TRANSCRIPT - ABC interview with Lucy Barbour - 23 January 2020
E&OE
LUCY BARBOUR:
Given what happened yesterday, the $36,000 grant and the fact that the PM announced that he referred this inquiry to his own department, do you think Bridget McKenzie should resign?
MICHAEL MCCORMACK:
No I don't because what needs to happen now is due process needs to follow its right and proper course. So the Secretary of Prime Minister and Cabinet will make a determination based on the evidence put before him and he will report back to the Prime Minister when he's done so.
LUCY BARBOUR:
If it’s found that Senator McKenzie has breached ministerial standards, should she then resign?
MICHAEL MCCORMACK:
That's a matter of conjecture. We'll wait and see what the Secretary of Prime Minister and Cabinet Phil Gaetjens comes back with and let's not pre-empt any outcome of his investigations, his report …
LUCY BARBOUR:
That would be the honourable course of action, would it not?
MICHAEL MCCORMACK:
Well again I say, I don't want to pre-empt anything that the Secretary is looking into by making any statements as to what might or might not happen following his report. I'm hoping that everything comes back with a clean bill of health because as I've discussed with Bridget McKenzie and looking at the program, it's a very successful program. It is providing sponsorship and funding for hundreds of sporting clubs and its benefit is felt keenly, particularly in regional areas, those small villages and towns and sporting clubs, which would have no capacity to raise the sorts of funds that has been provided under this wonderful program, other than applying for and receiving money through this program, which Bridget has managed and every single one of the projects was deemed eligible for funding.
LUCY BARBOUR:
So if the inquiry finds that she has breached ministerial standards, what would happen with her role as Federal Agriculture Minister?
MICHAEL MCCORMACK:
Well I say again, let's see what comes back from the Secretary of PM&C.
LUCY BARBOUR:
Procedurally, technically, what would happen would she … does the Prime Minister have the power to sack her as Agriculture Minister?
MICHAEL MCCORMACK:
Well we all serve in cabinet and in a ministerial position at the request and appointment of the Prime Minister of the day. That's always been the case and so obviously, the report will come back and the Prime Minister will read that report and make a decision based on that.
LUCY BARBOUR:
But as Nationals Leader who reaches a Coalition agreement with the Prime Minister, wouldn’t you have the power to argue that she should stay as Agriculture Minister if you want her to? Isn’t that a fight that you would have to have with the Prime Minister?
MICHAEL MCCORMACK:
Well the Prime Minister and I discuss any number of things and yes, we always discuss these matters and matters of the ministry, matters of legislation.
LUCY BARBOUR:
So you would allow the Prime Minister to sack her if …
MICHAEL MCCORMACK:
No. What I say and I'm not even going to pre-empt what the Secretary might come back with but we do serve at the request and appointment of the Prime Minister of the day. That happens with our appointments. That happens when the Labor Opposition at the moment, when they're in government. It's happened right from, you know, the start of the Federation in 1901. People serve as ministers. They are appointed by the Government of the day obviously, they're sworn in by the Governor General, but they do so at the request of the Prime Minister of the day.
LUCY BARBOUR:
And if she has breached ministerial standards, should Bridget McKenzie resign as Deputy Leader of the Nationals? Is that what would technically happen, do you think? I know we are being speculative but …
MICHAEL MCCORMACK:
We are. And we are being hypothetical and I'm hoping that the report comes back and shows that Bridget has done nothing wrong.
LUCY BARBOUR:
But could she stay on as Deputy Leader? Is there any way that could happen, even if she had breached ministerial standards?
MICHAEL MCCORMACK:
Well, again, I don't want to get into if, buts and maybes. Let's give Phil Gaetjens the clear air he needs to look at all the information that's going to be put before him and let him make a determination based on that evidence, report back to the Prime Minister and we'll go from there.
LUCY BARBOUR:
There were some reports today that Bridget McKenzie was going to resign tomorrow. She quickly stamped on those and said no, she wasn't …
MICHAEL MCCORMACK:
As she should have, as she should have, because I think sometimes the media decides to play judge, jury and executioner, I think sometimes …
LUCY BARBOUR:
But the media are getting that information from somewhere. Are you concerned that perhaps Liberals are leaking against her?
MICHAEL MCCORMACK:
Well, the information was untrue, wherever, whatever source it came from, whether it was an MP, in fact, whether it was just simply made up and the media just wanted to play a role in this, as sometimes the media has wanted to do. But the fact is, the information was untrue and Bridget has put a stop to that by saying that she's not going anywhere and we're all going to be waiting for the report to come back.
LUCY BARBOUR:
I mean some Nats say that, quiet privately, that this is pretty chaotic and they say that this is a reflection on your leadership. What's your response to that?
MICHAEL MCCORMACK:
No Nats have said that to me. So again, I'll just put that down to pure speculation and if any Nats want to have a conversation to me about it, then they all know my number and I’m more than happy to chat to them about it, in fact, I'm driving back to my electorate at the moment and I am of course doing a bit of work as I drive along, hands free of course and talking to my colleagues not just about this, but about our relief effort and recovery efforts with the bushfire. I visited Batlow and Tumbarumba yesterday as well as Tumut. That's the immediate priority of The National Party. We are making sure that those areas so badly affected by the bushfires are receiving the assistance they need. That's the immediate and an ongoing concerns and efforts that are being put in by The National Party and that will continue to be.
LUCY BARBOUR:
And if Bridget McKenzie resigns or is forced to step aside, would you be worried in any way that perhaps the National Party might revolt and want your position spilled as well?
MICHAEL MCCORMACK:
Again, pure speculation. Politics is one day at a time, generally one hour at a time. All I'm doing is I’m making sure that we do the right thing by our drought-affected communities, by our bushfire-affected communities. I had a very good roundtable today with the Prime Minister and the Treasurer and other ministers with the Indigenous community and of course, bushfires were also very much a focus of that meeting and just doing my job. People in Australia, particularly regional Australians don't want us to be focused and looking inwardly. They want us to do the job for and on behalf to make their lives better and that's what I'm doing and that's what I've always done every hour of every working day that I've spent in this role as Deputy Prime Minister and that's what I'll go on doing.
LUCY BARBOUR:
Michael, thank you so much for that.
MICHAEL MCCORMACK:
Thanks, Lucy.